Hamas sweeps to election victory

[Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

You are so intelligent Chase, that I really cant believe you cant see american foreign policy as one of the reasons of terrorism increasing all over the world!!!!!

So how would YOU combat terrorism? You can't be diplomatic with people who want to kill Jews, Christians, atheists, liberals, homosexuals, and everyone else living in the Western world.

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Chase)

So how would YOU combat terrorism? You can't be diplomatic with people who want to kill Jews, Christians, atheists, liberals, homosexuals, and everyone else living in the Western world.

Like YOU... I DONT KNOW how to stop terrorism... but if US foreign policy changes a 'little' maybe it results in less terrorism...

[RMadd]

Ana: terrorism isn't only an anti-American sentiment. merely re-thinking our foreign policy isn't going to put an end to it. for many people, it has become a way of life. some live in societies in which they are repressed, and so they resort to violence as a means of expressing their opinions and viewpoints.

on a related note, how, exactly would you propose the u.s. change its foreign policy? to simply not including war? while i may agree with you there, there's a handful of instances i can think of in which the u.s. didn't launch a full-scale invasion of a country. also, just because we've had one president and his advisers who advocates such action doesn't mean that it will continue as such. i would imagine that our next president will be decidedly less pro-war than Pres. Bush and his top advisers (Wolfowitz, Rummy, Cheney, etc) are, simply because i don't think the majority of americans will put up with another 4 or 8 years of threatening another country to go to war (iran comes to mind).

also, i'd like to point out that many analysts are saying that Hamas came into power, not because of staunch anti-American or anti-Israeli sentiment in the Palestinian areas, but more so simply because the voters had become frustrated with Fatah and Abbas, and democratically booted them.

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Rmadd)

Ana: terrorism isn't only an anti-American sentiment. merely re-thinking our foreign policy isn't going to put an end to it. for many people, it has become a way of life. some live in societies in which they are repressed, and so they resort to violence as a means of expressing their opinions and viewpoints

I DIDNT say that reconsidering US foreign policy will put an end to terrorism!!!!I said that maybe it will results in less terrorism...and btw I mentioned it because Chase seems keep ignoring it...

Quote: (Originally Posted by Rmadd)

on a related note, how, exactly would you propose the u.s. change its foreign policy? to simply not including war? while i may agree with you there, there's a handful of instances i can think of in which the u.s. didn't launch a full-scale invasion of a country. also, just because we've had one president and his advisers who advocates such action doesn't mean that it will continue as such. i would imagine that our next president will be decidedly less pro-war than Pres. Bush and his top advisers (Wolfowitz, Rummy, Cheney, etc) are, simply because i don't think the majority of americans will put up with another 4 or 8 years of threatening another country to go to war (iran comes to mind).

Oh I hope you are right Ryan and your next president can be less pro-war...I REALLy hope it.

For changing US foreign policy ...analists (not me) proposes that US stop forcing exporting democracy... I mean Bush pressed Mahmoud Abbas too much to convoke elections... because they tought Fatahs party could obtain an ample and easy victory, but we saw the opposite and now Bush says he wont deal with terrorists of Hamas...
But Hamas won the election...they were democratically put in the power!!!!

Quote: (Originally Posted by Rmadd)

also, i'd like to point out that many analysts are saying that Hamas came into power, not because of staunch anti-American or anti-Israeli sentiment in the Palestinian areas, but more so simply because the voters had become frustrated with Fatah and Abbas, and democratically booted them.

Yes ...I agree with that. And also because Hamas did a good social work with people: since 1987 they built an expressive number of schools, hospitals and religious institutions. Hamas succeed where Fatah had failed...

[RMadd]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

Yes ...I agree with that. And also because Hamas did a good social work with people: since 1987 they built an expressive number of schools, hospitals and religious institutions. Hamas succeed where Fatah had failed...

but what kind of schools? i know, at least in other Islamic countries, there are madras schools: they're free schools that educate children whose parents cannot afford the public education provided by the state or any other private education. this might seem like a good deal, but they actually inculcate these susceptible young minds with anti-American, anti-Western, and anti-democratic concepts. they're essentially a terrorist feeder (just like the way the minor leagues work in baseball here).

[Chase]

This is an ideology that really gained momentum following the Iran hostage crisis and the Soviet Invasion of Afghanistan. While war and force alone won't put and end to terrorism... attention should be paid to the root of the problem. Arab children are being indoctrinated to hate people of different cultures. The issue is far larger than the United States and Israel. What do Americans and Israelis have to do with Islamic aggression towards Hindus in India? Nothing. There's a lof of hatred growing throughout the poverty stricken Arab regions and something has to be done about that.

[RalphyS]

Sure the Arabs/Palestinians indoctrinate their children with their worldview and sure I don't agree with that, but cleaning starts at home.

The Christians in America try to indoctrinate creationism or its newest version ID into their children.

They don't do this because they don't want to give all the learning opportunities to their children, but because they, ironically enough, think it is the truth.

In the same manor the Arabs/Palestinians think they learn their children the truth, when they educate them about the 'perversities' of the western world and why you should fight western influence on islamic nations.

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by RalphyS)

Sure the Arabs/Palestinians indoctrinate their children with their worldview and sure I don't agree with that, but cleaning starts at home.

The Christians in America try to indoctrinate creationism or its newest version ID into their children.

They don't do this because they don't want to give all the learning opportunities to their children, but because they, ironically enough, think it is the truth.

In the same manor the Arabs/Palestinians think they learn their children the truth, when they educate them about the 'perversities' of the western world and why you should fight western influence on islamic nations.

Exactly! I was about to say the same thing...lol ...as always you said it properly.

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by RMadd)

but what kind of schools? i know, at least in other Islamic countries, there are madras schools: they're free schools that educate children whose parents cannot afford the public education provided by the state or any other private education. this might seem like a good deal, but they actually inculcate these susceptible young minds with anti-American, anti-Western, and anti-democratic concepts. they're essentially a terrorist feeder (just like the way the minor leagues work in baseball here).

And in America you have schools/media teaching you are (of course guided by Bush) the good guys who need to use war to spread the democracy all over the world...

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Chase)

This is an ideology that really gained momentum following the Iran hostage crisis and the Soviet Invasion of Afghanistan. While war and force alone won't put and end to terrorism... attention should be paid to the root of the problem. Arab children are being indoctrinated to hate people of different cultures. The issue is far larger than the United States and Israel. What do Americans and Israelis have to do with Islamic aggression towards Hindus in India? Nothing. There's a lof of hatred growing throughout the poverty stricken Arab regions and something has to be done about that.

You know what the real problem is Chase ? You american think that outside America people want to be saved/helped...but have you asked for one single moment if they want to be 'saved'??? And saved from what??? From their ideology, their culture?

This is YOUR ideology!!!!!!!!! NOT theirs!!!!!

[RMadd]

Quote: (Originally Posted by RalphyS)

Sure the Arabs/Palestinians indoctrinate their children with their worldview and sure I don't agree with that, but cleaning starts at home.

The Christians in America try to indoctrinate creationism or its newest version ID into their children.

yeahhhhh, see... the difference is, my parents didn't teach me militant creationism, and that's not what i'll pass on to my kids some day. i suppose some may argue that president bush & his cronies are slightly militant, but that's not necessarily in specific regard to creationism.

Quote: (Originally Posted by RalphyS)

They don't do this because they don't want to give all the learning opportunities to their children, but because they, ironically enough, think it is the truth.

In the same manor the Arabs/Palestinians think they learn their children the truth, when they educate them about the 'perversities' of the western world and why you should fight western influence on islamic nations.

i get what you're saying there. i suppose my only retort would be that we need to edumacate these folks properly, but that seems a bit high-headed of me, doesn't it?

[RMadd]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

You know what the real problem is Chase ? You american think that outside America people want to be saved/helped...but have you asked for one single moment if they want to be 'saved'??? And saved from what??? From their ideology, their culture?

This is YOUR ideology!!!!!!!!! NOT theirs!!!!!

so, would you advocate the United States pulling out of international affairs altogether? truthfully, what kind of response do you suppose this would generate? remember when we were getting all sorts of crap last year when, following the tsunami, although we had perhaps the greatest sum of donations, we had a fairly low per capita donation by our government (excluding donations by private national and multinational corporations). the impression i got from that was, "the U.S. government isn't doing much at all to help us out; where are they in our time of need?"

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by RMadd)

so, would you advocate the United States pulling out of international affairs altogether? truthfully, what kind of response do you suppose this would generate? remember when we were getting all sorts of crap last year when, following the tsunami, although we had perhaps the greatest sum of donations, we had a fairly low per capita donation by our government (excluding donations by private national and multinational corporations). the impression i got from that was, "the U.S. government isn't doing much at all to help us out; where are they in our time of need?"

No... no...no... you misunderstood it completely!!!!!!

I wasnt refering to money or donations ...I was talking about the mission US (governement and people)thinks that has all over the world...I mean spreding democracy, forcing countries to swallow this, because its the better thing to do ...Being the worlds policy!
" This (poor) country needs a liitle bit of democracy--lets give it to their people!! "And if they dont accept it though the use of diplomacy...so we have to use WAR!!!!!"

Of course US only does it when the 'country' has something interesting to offer to America...like Iraq, right???

[Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

You know what the real problem is Chase ? You american think that outside America people want to be saved/helped...but have you asked for one single moment if they want to be 'saved'??? And saved from what??? From their ideology, their culture?

This is YOUR ideology!!!!!!!!! NOT theirs!!!!!

If their ideology calls me an "infidel" and wants me dead, then I have a major problem with it.

[Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

And in America you have schools/media teaching you are (of course guided by Bush) the good guys who need to use war to spread the democracy all over the world...

Here's another stereotype. I've gone through the American public school system and it's not like that at all. If that was the case... then my school teachers would have painted a pretty little picture of slavery and American imperialism following the Spanish American War.

"Of course guided by Bush?" The President doesn't dictate what children learn in school. What are you talking about?