Teacher on leave after alleged anti-Bush words

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Chase)

Hitler killed millions of innocent Jews by having them incinerated and shot to death. Bush hasn't done that. Therefore, he is lying and not telling the truth.

I NEVER compared Bush with Hitler...and this the point I can disagree with the teacher.

[Steve]

I don't remember the source and I don't feel like searching for it (perhaps someone else read this too and can link it) but there was information given that said studies showed the leevees would break in a huge storm and this information was given to the local government long before this storm. I understand the president is an easy target to place blame on for things but it seems people so easily and freely blame Bush for everything when in fact I'd blame the local New Orleans government for certain aspects of this first. And then with the Iraqi Intelligence reports... well Bush compounds and gathers all intelligence so it's his fault the reports were wrong.

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Steve)

Are you implying history refers to future events? Maybe I've been taught wrong all these years... sure future events will become history, but that doesn't make them history to begin with.

You know Steve...History refers to our 'present' time too...History is made EVERYDAY...for all of us...but we dont realized this...unless the 'event is too evident... like in september 11 attacks...I m sure that a lot of students (in the whole wordl) who barely understood what History is --started to SEE History as something "alive' after the atacks...

Quote:

When I was in highschool two of my history teachers were stanch liberals. They often discussed their political views, but not during classtime. When it came time to discuss current events, they kept their personal viewpoints out of the way of the discussion. That's what a teacher is supposed to do. A teacher of history is not supposed to give his/her personal viewpoints. They are supposed to encourage personal and individual thought and teach an unbiased lesson.

Well most of history teachers are liberals...no surprise in here...

But I think you are misunderstanding my comments...and Ill try to clarify them;

Look... for once and for all....I NEVER imposed my politicals beliefs to my students...because I teach with ethic, right? But I do defend the debates/discussion with students as an important thing...this is part of their educations in these days...when teachers needs to compete with computers, web, tvs.
And we have to consider that info cames a 'high speed' to the students ...so teachers CANT ignore certain issues --we need to be well informed about 'everything' (if it was possible, of course) in class...we have to teach not only about WWII (past) but also about war in Iraq(present)--its evident.

But waht bothers me more is that now the teacher is on leave---like he needed to be 'punished'---and I really CANt agree with this 'solution'.

[Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mrprophetman)

He is partially responsible for the fact that dead people floated in the water in New Orleans for almost two weeks before anyone had the thought to retreive the bodies. And all that time Bush said no one could have know the levee's would be breached. Turns out he knew more than anyone thought.

One of the most important sea ports in this country and there had been no improvements to the levee's since the 1960's

So the fact that Mayor Nagin refused to follow evacuation orders... and there was a lot of irresponsibility by the state governor, you're trying to equate Bush to Adolf Hitler? WOW.

Last time I checked... George Bush didn't invade Poland with the sole purpose of eliminating the entire Jewish population and enslaving the Slavs. Last time I checked George Bush didn't create a permanent settlement in an area that is primarily under sea level.

[Ana4Stapp]

Just wondering...if he (the teacher) was praising Bush in classroom would it be right? An appropriate attitude?

[Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

Just wondering...if he (the teacher) was praising Bush in classroom would it be right? An appropriate attitude?

Of course it wouldn't... why indoctrinate kids with YOUR beliefs. That's not your job.

And for the record... debate is healthy... but it's even healthier if teachers stay out of it.

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Chase)

Of course it wouldn't... why indoctrinate kids with YOUR beliefs. That's not your job.

And for the record... debate is healthy... but it's even healthier if teachers stay out of it.

Its hard to stay out of the debates,Chase...especially when STUDENTS want to know their teacher's opinions and ask them...and they usually do it...

[Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

Its hard to stay out of the debates,Chase...especially when STUDENTS want to know their teacher's opinions and ask them...and they usually do it...

Why do you debate kids?

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Chase)

Why do you debate kids?

i didnt say kids especifically --most of the times i debate with teens---but if you were a teacher and your students asked your opinion...what would you do? Tell them to keep quiet?

[Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

i didnt say kids especifically --most of the times i debate with teens---but if you were a teacher and your students asked your opinion...what would you do? Tell them to keep quiet?

I would give them my opinion in a tasteful manner, but would refrain from disputing their arguments.

[Steve]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

i didnt say kids especifically --most of the times i debate with teens---but if you were a teacher and your students asked your opinion...what would you do? Tell them to keep quiet?

Well the best history teacher I ever had was sophomore year in high school. He taught AP Euro History. One in awhile we discussed current events and oftentimes people asked the teacher what his opinion was. He refused to give his opinion. He told us his opinion didn't matter. Instead he presented both sides of the issue and encouraged the class to debate with each other rather than him "taking over" the debate.

I agree with Chase. It's not the teacher's job to debate students and to present their personal, biased opinions on issues, especially political ones.

[uncertaindrumer]

Actually, past present future is NOT the way which we look at time anymore. Now, it is past, future, and "elsewhere". Explaining what that "elsewhere" is takes a lot of physics but no, it is not just past present future anymore

Anyway, I agree with Chase and Steve. History should teach HISTORY, not current events. Current events are current, history is what has already happened. Hiding behind "well we are making history" is a Sophistry and a weak one at that.

And no, teachers should NOT indoctrinate their students in any way, shape or form. Man this is why math is so much cooler than stuff like history or writing. Objectivity, baby.

[Ana4Stapp]

Quote: (Originally Posted by uncertaindrumer)

Actually, past present future is NOT the way which we look at time anymore. Now, it is past, future, and "elsewhere". Explaining what that "elsewhere" is takes a lot of physics but no, it is not just past present future anymore

Anyway, I agree with Chase and Steve. History should teach HISTORY, not current events. Current events are current, history is what has already happened. Hiding behind "well we are making history" is a Sophistry and a weak one at that.

And no, teachers should NOT indoctrinate their students in any way, shape or form. Man this is why math is so much cooler than stuff like history or writing. Objectivity, baby.

Wow..it amazing how everybody here seem to know too much about History... without being at a college student (except for Chase who really studies History)..and sorry but I cant agree with you about what History is...or how a teacher must teach it...

But its amazing how you people THINK that know what History is...and its also sad that you THINK that History is simply the past...too sad people... and too wrong...

anyway...you are experts in History and seems that I have nothing more to say here...

[eusebioCBR]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ana4Stapp)

Wow..it amazing how everybody here seem to know too much about History... without being at a college student (except for Chase who really studies History)..and sorry but I cant agree with you about what History is...or how a teacher must teach it...

But its amazing how you people THINK that know what History is...and its also sad that you THINK that History is simply the past...too sad people... and too wrong...

anyway...you are experts in History and seems that I have nothing more to say here...

Thanks for pointing out the fault in our "uneducated" opinion.

[uncertaindrumer]

Actually, Ana, you have no clue what I do since I have never told anyone online.

But the DEFINITION of history is things already gone by. If you want to disagree with facts, go ahead and do it. But sticking your own ideas about what "history" is (in contradiction to what it ACTUALLY is, though at the moment that is unimportant), is precisely what we are talking about. You telling me your opinions on what history REALLY is, is acceptable. But trying to tell your students that history is not the things gone past is ludicrous. That is simply untrue. If history included the present, it would no longer be "history".